Mustafa Karasu, member of the KCK (Kurdistan Communities Union) Executive Council, spoke to Medya Haber TV on the latest developments in the context of the Third World War, with a special focus on the developments in Syria.

We publish the first part of the comprehensive interview below.

The expansion of the war in the region, known as the Third World War, has reached a new level and brought Syria to the brink of collapse. How do you assess the current situation in the country?

The Third World War is going on. And the center of the Third World War is the Middle East. Especially in the last year, after Hamas attacked Israel and massacred 1200 people and took nearly 200 hostages, the war in the Middle East has become even more widespread.

In the First World War, the Zionist Jews, step by step, put into action their plan to settle in Palestine. In the course of the Second World War, the State of Israel was established. And now, in the Third World War, a war is being waged to ensure the security of this state of Israel. The war currently being waged in the Middle East is essentially a war for Israel’s security. It is a war to remove all obstacles to Israel’s security. Not just the US, NATO and Europe, but all hegemonic powers fully support this world war for Israel’s security. All hegemonic powers support the redesign of the Middle East on the basis of Israel’s security.

Historically, the Jews have always lived in this area. Israel is there. The Jews were driven into exile three times until they finally founded a state. Eventually, their existence must be accepted. Neither the approach of those who deny its existence, who do not accept it, and say that they will wipe it out, is right, nor is the expansion policy of Israel. Nothing can be achieved in the Middle East with such approaches and policies. From this point of view, Israel’s existence is going to be recognized, but Israel must give up its policy of expansion. Coexistence can be established based on the model of the democratic nation.

Now, there is the question of how Syria fell. In this regard, Comrade Abbas last said something a month or two ago. Iran is pursuing a wrong policy. Why did Iran drive Hezbollah against Israel? Comrade Abbas said that they should have been prevented from doing so. The Turkish state provoked and tricked Iran. Every day, they said, “Why doesn’t Iran attack Israel? Why doesn’t Hezbollah attack Israel? Why doesn’t it show solidarity with Gaza? Why doesn’t it do this and that?” Hezbollah attacked Israel under the influence of this. And Europe, the USA, and all the states are behind it. It’s a world war. The bloc waging this World War launched an attack on all forces that threatened Israel’s security. There was a defeat; Hezbollah was crushed. Maybe it survived, but it suffered a massive blow. Syria was kept alive by Hezbollah, Iran, and Russia. These also suffered a massive blow. Israel weakening these forces paved the way for the offensive by HTS. This is clear. They still did not see Syria as a country that would accept Israel’s security. In fact, Syria was slowly trying to adapt; it was trying to rid itself of the anti-Israeli approach. But they wanted Syria to be completely subsumed into their policies. When this could not be done, Hezbollah was weakened, and Iran was weakened. They already hit the essential targets inside Syria, and then Turkey pushed HTS and FSA onto the pre-softened ground. This process of HTS and FSA entering Syria is linked to Israel’s aggression policies in the region. The Turkish state shows itself so anti-Israel; it does this and that; it still says Israel is this and that, but it wants to dominate Syria, which has been weakened by Israeli attacks. So, there is a connection and relationship with Israel. Maybe they planned it jointly; we don’t know, but it is certain that they attacked a Syria weakened by Israel and the forces behind Israel.

Just as the Turkish state supported ISIS, it is now supporting HTS and the FSA. All of these are jihadists. There is no such thing as a moderate, democratic approach. They try to present some of them as such, but that is just deception. Ideologically, they are derivatives of ISIS. HTS is also an extension of al-Qaeda. There was the emir of ISIS that was eliminated in Idlib. The fact he was in Idlib shows that he was with HTS. And it is also known that he was in contact with the Turkish state.

This, of course, also affects the Kurds and the balances in the Middle East. Right now, Syria is in a very difficult situation. Will the Syrian state survive? Will it protect itself? It is not clear yet. Syria will be doomed to HTS. HTS is ISIS; they are jihadists. I guess these are not the forces that will ensure Israel’s security. If the Syrian regime is being targeted on the basis of ensuring Israel’s security, if the regime is collapsing, HTS will probably not be able to ensure Israel’s security in its place. If it is a question of ensuring Israel’s security, the ideology and approach of Assad’s regime in Syria may be more favorable. He could have come to accommodation with Israel or the West. Now it is not clear what will happen.

They have already laid siege to Shahba. According to the information we received, they could have resisted. They had preparations. But because the political balance changed, the Autonomous Administration of North and East Syria withdrew on the basis of a certain agreement. I guess the coalition forces were also involved. But they are resisting in Sheikh Maqsoud. The people in Shahba were migrants. They were living in tents there, but the Kurds in Sheikh Maqsoud, the Kurds who have a place, a home, a house, everything there, who have been living as part of Aleppo for many years, have decided to resist until the end. They said that they will resist until their local democracy, existence, and political system are accepted. They are not going to stand down and accept HTS’s and FSA’s political understanding and understanding of life. We hear that they have made such a decision.

The attack in Syria will probably change the balance in the Middle East. Turkey will try to take advantage of this, it seems. Indeed, it is the Turkish state that manages and directs both the FSA and HTS. The Turkish state will make bargains through this, but there is also the fact that the Turkish state’s policies, its support for HTS, its support for the FSA, and its support for the jihadists may cause trouble for Turkey once this fact is clearly revealed.

On the one hand, so many steps are being taken in the name of guaranteeing Israel’s security, war is being waged, while on the other hand, the Turkish state is doing so much against Israel’s measures and installing anti-Israeli forces in Syria. It is doubtful how long this will last. The Kurdish forces will undoubtedly feel the impact of this. They are facing heavy attacks, but they will resist.

The Turkish state, AKP, and Erdoğan are behind the attacks and tragic developments in Syria. Erdoğan provoked the Syrian civil war, hoping that the state would collapse as soon as possible so that the Kurds would not benefit. The whole purpose of developing the civil war in Syria to such an extent, the regime’s response, the organization of those gangs, is to prevent the Kurds from gaining anything.

The AKP is behind these attacks. They are saying it openly; one must just turn on one of their TV channels and listen to them. They all discuss what the PYD and what SDF are doing. They are afraid that the influence of the PYD and SDF will spread through the area. They say that they are becoming a danger to Turkey. That is how they always analyze it in their press. Their intention to destroy the Kurdish gains is the reason for their relations with the FSA and HTS.

They will try to drive both the FSA and HTS against the Autonomous Administration. In this respect, since the essence of the Turkish state’s policies is Kurdish enmity, since the essence of its Syria policy is Kurdish enmity, it can agree with anyone on the basis of Kurdish enmity. In exchange for the destruction of the Kurds, it can compromise with everyone it is hostile to. Turkey today is such a state. It has no concerns about the Syrian people or any specific organization. Its only concern is that the Kurds cannot be effective in Rojava, in North and East Syria.

In this respect, the Kurds need to take a position accordingly. The Turkish state will not give up this policy. It will direct these attacks against the Autonomous Administration. The Turkish state will put Rojava on the table in all negotiations about Syria. They may hold an Astana meeting in Doha and many more for this purpose. In all of these, the first agenda of the Turkish state is Rojava. It has made a statement: “We are not in favor of the division of Syria; we defend the unity of Syria, and we will protect its unity.” When they say this, they do not mean that the FSA is splitting Syria, doing this or that in Syria. It is all about the Kurds. Kurds gaining rights is considered separatism. Just like in Turkey, recognizing the existence of Kurds is seen as separatism. This is also how they want to make it be seen in Syria. Everyone should be aware of this approach of Turkey and act accordingly.

The Kurdish people in Syria, in Rojava, know from years of experience that the Turkish state wants to eliminate the Autonomous Administration. There is a deep consciousness of this fact because of the occupation of Afrin, Serekaniye, and Gire Spi. There are constant attacks; the attacks have never stopped, as the massacres have never stopped. There are attacks against Shahba. Northeast Syria, Rojava, is targeted every day. Manbij is being targeted. The Kurdish people are aware of the policies of the Turkish state. They know that they need to be prepared. We think that they have come to the realization that they cannot protect their autonomy and freedom without resisting and fighting against the Turkish state. They cannot protect their self-administration. The way to do this is to resist the Turkish state and its gangs. We assume that, knowing this fact, appropriate preparations have been made throughout the past years. It was always reflected in the press: “We will resist!” was said. They stated that their only goal was to defend North and East Syria against attacks.

In this respect, even if the preparations are incomplete, there may be shortcomings, but we think that there is important preparation. We think that the Kurdish people have the will to resist. They have also declared mobilization. In this respect, if they are determined and willful, the Kurdish people have the power to fight. The Kurdish people are not like before; today they have fighters. They have yielded more than ten thousand martyrs and tens of thousands of wounded in the war against ISIS. There is a community that has grown in the war. They have been living in war for a long time. They are capable of waging this war. We believe in this. The people will definitely fight and resist. We think that the administration and cadres there have this will.

On the other hand, these groups, like HTS and FSA, the Turkish state, have enmity against the system there, enmity against the philosophy of freedom, and enmity against the principles of democracy because they see freedom and democracy as their enemies. They know that they cannot live where there is freedom and democracy. Just as the Turkish state fears democracy and freedom and is hostile to them, HTS and FSA are also hostile to them.

In North and East Syria, a first bit of freedom and democracy has been tasted. A free and democratic life has begun to emerge. They will fight to protect this with every means they have, to their last breath. We believe this, and in this respect, we wish them success in their struggle.

Considering the dangers for Syria as a whole, but also for Rojava and North and East Syria in particular, what is the responsibility of the other parts of Kurdistan and the world public?

Rojava is the smallest part of Kurdistan, smaller in population and geography than the other parts. But this small part has supported the struggle in all other parts of Kurdistan. Rojava has already made a big contribution to the unity of Kurdistan. And there are many people who support the struggle in southern Kurdistan, in northern Kurdistan, as well as eastern Kurdistan. All parts of Kurdistan have lost many martyrs. The support for Rojava is a historical responsibility. The other parts must not leave Rojava alone and must support it. Otherwise, the Turkish state or other forces will attack it as the weak link. In the Kobane resistance and later in the war against ISIS, all parts supported Rojava. There was a constant flow from northern Kurdistan to Kobane. Every day in Suruc, there was moral support and people joining the fight. The whole world gave support. Again, with the protests for Kobane from October 6 to 8, they actually finalized the defeat of ISIS. These actions played a huge role in the defeat of ISIS. It created great motivation in the resistance. Then ISIS went downhill. Hundreds of young people from southern Kurdistan rushed to Kobane, rushed to Rojava, and put up great resistance. The political forces in southern Kurdistan supported the Rojava resistance. Our people around the world supported it. The same support should also be given in this process. The danger is no less than ISIS, maybe even more dangerous than ISIS. ISIS was exposed in a way. Now the Turkish state is trying to legitimize HTS.

All Kurdish people need to give support to Rojava and the resistance; they need to stand up everywhere. They need to mobilize as they did in the Kobane resistance. There needs to be a great uprising in Europe. All over the world, democratic peoples in different countries need to stand up.

The Turkish State and the gangs of FSA and HTS are planning to attack Rojava; they are planning it. The revolution and Rojava must be defended. This is very important. This defense is the defense of all of Kurdistan; it is the defense of northern Kurdistan, the defense of southern Kurdistan, as well as the defense of eastern Kurdistan. One should not take a casual approach.

Currently, southern Kurdistan remains in the position of an observer, which is not appropriate. We need to openly support Rojava. The Turkish state and its gangs must be dealt with openly. It must be made clear that whoever touches the Autonomous Administration will find all Kurds against them. Because the danger is perhaps greater than ISIS. The war will intensify; it will be a massive war. And it will be met with fierce resistance. Where such a fierce war and resistance are going on, Kurds need to be on their feet day and night. They must never stop; they must not recognize any obstacles. The Kobane resistance of October 6 to 8 is exemplary in this regard. The Suruc resistance is exemplary. Taking these examples into consideration, the sensitivity in all parts of Kurdistan must be raised.

Former British Prime Minister Tony Blair once said, “We pursue a moral policy all over the world. We stand up for our principles. But when it comes to the Middle East, we cannot defend them.” Maybe he did not say it using these exact words, but this was the essence of his statement.

There are states in the Middle East that suppress the Kurds, particularly Turkey, Iran, Iraq and Syria, and they have relations with international powers. When states take their own interests as a basis, they turn a blind eye to policies on the Kurds. Currently, there is a complete genocide in Kurdistan. There is genocide being persecuted in northern Kurdistan, the policy of the state there is completely genocidal, it’s a cultural genocide. In Rojava, Afrin was occupied, hundreds of thousands of people migrated. Serekaniye and Gire Spi were occupied and hundreds of thousands of people migrated. They live in camps and there are many camps. But there is not enough sensitivity towards this. The sensitivity regarding Gaza was not sufficient either, but at least it existed to a certain extent. The United Nations was constantly making statements, aid and health supplies were being sent to the besieged neighborhoods of Gaza. There was an agenda. Yes, Israel was not listening, it was doing all kinds of things with the world behind it. But there was also international public opinion, even states were criticizing Israel’s policy. Now so many people are being displaced, living in camps, being expelled from their lands. No matter if Gaza or elsewhere, we must oppose expulsion. Everyone should live in their own land. The Afrin residents were displaced from their own land. They had come to Shahba, and they were expelled from there too. We listen to them on TV; “Where will we go?” they say.

Now the people are resisting in Sheikh Maqsoud, it is under siege. According to what is understood and rumored, they are not allowed to deliver supplies. They are leaving nothing; they say they will kill the people there from hunger and thirst. There is such an attack. Of course, world public opinion and democratic forces must take action against this. It is called human rights. Then there is the general situation in Syria that needs to be faced. In Shahba, women were beheaded, people were killed, raped. Syrian soldiers were beheaded, they did all kinds of things. This is an army of gangs and mercenaries that does not care about any human values, war law. They have now gone to Homs and Hama, but they will also head towards North and East Syria. North and East Syria will resist. It needs to resist; by risking all kinds of difficulties and losses. Maybe a thousand or five thousand people will die in one day. Freedom and democracy can only be won through struggle, by paying the price. The other is a greater death. In this respect, of course, it is the Kurdish people who must resist; their own forces. It is necessary to rely on this. But international and democratic powers must not remain silent and watch the attacks on Rojava and North and East Syria. A conscience of humanity must stand up here. This people defeated ISIS. They suffered tens of thousands of martyrs and wounded. ISIS was slaughtering people and cutting their throats in Germany, France, Belgium, everywhere. Against such an enemy of humanity, this people sacrificed themselves, resisted and fought on behalf of all humanity. Tomorrow they will resist these gangs in the name of all humanity. If one has a conscience, they owe a debt to this people. In the face of this situation, everyone must fulfill their conscientious, moral and political responsibility against the attacks on North and East Syria.