In the third part of this in-depth interview, KCK Executive Council member, Mustafa Karasu spoke about the AKP-MHP government and its policies against Kurds as well as the Israeli war against Palestine.

The first part of this interview can be read here

The second part of this interview can be read here

As the AKP-MHP government insists on attacking your movement, the Kurdish people and the democratic forces, it deepens the crisis within Turkey. How should this situation be understood?

The 1990s, like today, were years when the dirty special war intensified. The Turkish state committed around 15 thousand unsolved murders (carried out by the state and Hizbulkontra), thousands of villages were burned down, over five million of our people were forced to migrate to metropolises and Europe, thousands of our people were imprisoned, and we faced severe torture. All this in order to suppress serhildans and crush the guerrillas. As a result of this dirty war, not only the economy has collapsed, but a social and cultural crisis has emerged. The morality and conscience of society have been corrupted through Kurdish enmity. Those who are enemies of Rêber Apo, the PKK, and the Kurds are allowed to do anything. They act like they have the right to do all kinds of dirty work. All social and cultural values have been corrupted; in other words, everything has gone haywire. At that time, drugs were being smuggled by the state itself to raise funds for the war. The war in the 1990s turned the state into a mafia. All kinds of dirty deeds and immorality were carried out under the name of being hostile to Rêber Apo and the PKK.

The last nine years look like the 1990s. There have been years of escalation in the dirty special war. Just like in the 1990s, an economic, political, social, and cultural crisis has emerged. Since everything was indexed to the dirty war, art, culture, and sports were turned into tools of the special war against the Kurdish people. The special war against the Kurdish people and the democratic forces has corrupted and polluted everything in Turkey. Turkey has become a corrupted and polluted country in every respect. A fascist dictatorship that has never been seen anywhere in the world has been established. Society has been turned into enemies. In fact, a state of civil war has been created. The AKP-MHP government has become a power of evil. A fascism has been created that focuses on what evil will be done to society and opposition forces in the morning and evening. A Turkish-type fascism unprecedented in the world has been built. The execution of a government whose policies are determined by the MHP as an alliance could not be expected otherwise.

In these nine years of AKP-MHP rule, MHP has spread everywhere like an octopus. From the police to the judiciary and bureaucracy. The MHP is a parallel state in Turkey. Since the AKP government has no purpose or principle other than to stay in power through political games, it is trying to prolong its life by turning a blind eye to various forces becoming parallel states. This is Erdoğan’s politics, his pragmatism. This policy has now become self-defeating. What was once said about the Fetullahists is now said about the MHP. Because of this status as a parallel state, Devlet Bahceli is making threats on a daily basis and is trying to adjust the government and other political forces.

The AKP-MHP government smuggles arms and drugs to raise money for the war. By attracting all the black money centers, mafias and gangs of Europe to Turkey, it has provided resources to its economy through black money. Currently, Turkey has become the country where all mafia organizations are based. It also harbors and feeds gang organizations such as ISIS, and then markets them when the time comes. Turkey has become the blackmail state, the ransom state of the world. Such a country does not only experience economic, political, social and cultural crises. The most widespread drug use in Turkey occurred during the period of AKP-MHP rule. Again, dragging women into prostitution increased during this period of government. Femicides also increased during this period, since this government maintains its power through misogyny. The woman is seen as an object on which power and sovereignty are based.

These dirty war policies polluted the state, society, and all institutions. It created the groundwork for the emergence of these mafia structures and gangs. What can be seen now is that there are internal fights about power. The gangs have risen even above the legal state; therefore, the state itself has become a gang state. In such a situation, conflict is inevitable. The gang organization that is now coming to light is only the tip of the iceberg. The gangs affiliated with the MHP are being organized and growing under the slogan ‘Vatan Millet Sakarya’. But there are gangs based not only on the MHP but also on the AKP. Those, on the other hand, organize and grow under the slogan ‘Religion, Faith, Call to Prayer’. Turkey has turned into a country parceled out by religious-nationalist gangs, and without a doubt, the war between those groups will increase even more. The MHP and the gangs under its protection will not give them the opportunity they have by saying, “When it comes to the homeland, everything else is unimportant.” This slogan has become the basic slogan of all fascists, gangs, and anti-democratic forces.

As the war between Israel and Hamas continues, the number of Palestinians killed has exceeded 36 thousand. Reactions against Israel are increasing day by day. Turkish President Erdoğan, on the other hand, continues to embrace Hamas openly. What is the current stage of Israel’s war on Palestine and what is Erdoğan’s influence on the Palestinian people’s struggle?

The Jewish-Arab conflict has a history of three thousand years. This fight existed even before the emergence of Islam. Religious and nationalist understandings ensure the continuation of this fight. As long as religious-nationalist and nation-state understandings are not abandoned, this fight cannot be ended. The solution to this problem cannot be the destruction of one by the other. In this respect, Democratic Confederalism, which refers to a democratic non-state administration in which all communities recognize each other, is the only solution. It is not a confederation of states. It is a democratic system where all different ethnic and religious communities are free and have their own governments. All other parts of society and all other peoples are also organized on a democratic basis, and they come together in a democratic confederal formation. Palestinians and Jews can live together in a democratic system that is not one in which one becomes a state and exercises sovereignty over the other. It is a system in which the Palestinians are free and self-governing in their own land. In the 21st century, this is the way to solve problems. It is necessary to overcome the nation-state mentality that has caused great suffering for humanity. The result of religious-nationalist understandings is today’s Israel-Hamas war.

Israel persecutes the Palestinian people under the pretext of Hamas. Of course, the mentality and actions of Hamas are unacceptable. Hamas has become a provocateur organization. However, massacring the Palestinian people in response to Hamas’ attacks is a crime against humanity. The human conscience does not accept this. Like this Israel is doomed. Neither Hamas nor Israel will win. This war has revealed that both mentalities have lost.

The whole world is now taking a conscientious, humane, moral, and democratic stand against Israel. This is due to the fact that in the 1960s and 1970s, the Palestinian liberation struggle hosted revolutionary and socialist organizations of 72 nations and national liberation fighters. The Palestinian people have thus established a relationship of friendship with the revolutionary democratic forces and peoples of the world. The PKK also stayed in Palestinian camps from 1979 on and benefited from the facilities of Palestinian organizations. The basis and source of the Palestinian people’s high level of support in the world today is that they opened their space to revolutionary organizations in the 1960s and 1970s. This reality has created today’s support. This is the reality that has created the magnitude of this support. This support has nothing to do with Hamas. It is the relationship that the Palestinian people and their organized forces established with the peoples of the world and revolutionary organizations 50–60 years ago. Palestinians and those who support the Palestinian struggle must be aware of this reality. It is not a public opinion created by Hamas and organizations with a similar mentality. It is a public opinion created by the democratic forces that have been in touch with the Palestinians for decades. Without recognizing this reality, one cannot understand the solidarity shown to the Palestinian people in the world today and the source of the reaction against Israel and its supporters.

Fascist Erdoğan’s pretense of being pro-Hamas is just a policy of threats and blackmail. He is saying that “if you want us to oppose Hamas, you will support my Kurdish and regional policy.” In essence, he is pursuing a policy of blackmail: “Support my Kurdish genocide policy, and I will change my Hamas policy.” The Turkish state does not want peace and stability in the Middle East. It has the understanding and policy that it needs war and chaos so that the Turkish state will be needed. At the moment, Turkey is the only state that wants the Israeli-Hamas war to spread and become an Israeli-Arab, Israeli-Iranian war. It is the AKP-MHP government in Turkey.

Let’s take for example Iran; President Ibrahim Reisi was killed in a helicopter crash. The TV channels affiliated with the AKP-MHP government have been the ones that have speculated the most on this issue and raised the possibility that he might have been shot by Israel. When these TV channels and the press are observed, it becomes clear that Turkey wants the war between Israel and Hamas to become widespread.

Everyone can see whether the AKP is truly siding with Palestine. The AKP insulted a member of parliament who disclosed that Erdoğan had the most trade agreements with Israel while claiming to support Palestine. They killed the person who said this, yet they did not end trade until after the March 31st elections. This alone shows that for the AKP-MHP government, what the Palestinian people are going through is only a political tool. Surely, no one believes that a government that persecutes other peoples and communities, especially Kurds, acts morally and conscientiously towards Palestine.

For decades, Turkey has been carrying out a policy of genocide against the Kurds with the support of the US and Europe through its relations with Israel. Today, if it has problems or takes a stance with Israel or any other power, it is because it wants to gain support for the Kurdish genocide. The Turkish state’s foreign policy is based on this. Its blackmails, threats, and criticism of certain powers, are all aimed at gaining such support. Both the Kurdish people and the democratic forces should be aware of this reality.